David's Class - Summer 2013.2 - WeeK 4: UNFORGIVEN

[DavidC]

This weeks movie depicts a situation in which it is difficult to know what is true (the women's story gets exaggerated before it reaches William Munny, the Schoefield Kid's story about himself isn't true, the writer's biography of English Bob is a bunch of lies, etc.) and it is difficult to know who (or even what) is good or bad.

In other words, it portrays a complex moral universe closer to our lived experience than to the black and white world of conventional American movies (Batman, Spiderman, Glory, etc.)

Use the terms of the movie to talk about President Obama's current decision about what to do in Syria. (If you don't have any ideas, answer one or more of the following questions.)

1. Is Obama (acting for the United States) like William Munny, who acts violently 1. for money, & 2. for revenge? Is he like Little Bill, who acts violently 1. to set an example that will discourage others from acting violently, & 2. to show how tough he is? Why? How?

2. Polls show that most Americans do NOT favor U.S. military action in Syria. Are these Americans like Ned (who is so scarred by the violence in his past -- think Afghanistan, Iraq -- that he can no longer act violently and must ride away from the fight)? If America fails to act, will America become a victim of violence like Ned? In other words, does Ned's fate illustrate the principle that we must either "kill or be killed"?

3. The movie convincingly establishes that violence is dark and terrible with long-lasting consequences. (Munny, for example is haunted by the memory of a man he killed; and the Schoefield Kid suffers extreme remorse as soon as he actually commits the act of violence he has been seeking for the whole movie.) But the movie also seems to justify Munny's regression to his role as a mean, effective and heartless killer by depicting Little Bill's torture and killing of Ned in such vivid and personal terms. Did Little Bill's treatment of Ned justify Munny's revenge? Would Assad's use of nerve gas justify Obama using American military power to cause death and destruction in Syria?

4. Think about your friends sitting around at home discussing the news of the world. In your conversations, how do you see the U.S.? Is it like a Batman movie or like UNFORGIVEN? In the view of your peers, does America exercise its great power of destruction in a morally clear way or a morally confused way? Or is it a mix? Give examples to illustrate what you mean?

[Ayae2013]

Hello, David.

I’d like to answer the question 3.
In the movie, Little Bill’s treatment of Ned justified Munny’s revenge. The scene of killing many people and Little Bill by Munny was horrible, but I don’t think that many people, including me, who watch this movie think of Munny as a bad man. In my mind, Little Bill looks like a bad man because his treatment of Ned was terrible. Unfortunately, I don’t know what happened between America and Syria well, but I think Assad’s use of nerve gas would justify Obama using American military power just as this movie does, even if it causes death and destruction in Syria. It seems to me that justifying a bad and terrible behavior like this may lead a horrible conflict or war.

See you on Wednesday!
Ayae Maeda

[alice03015]

Hi.
During this movie, I am thinking of who is unforgiven. Munny, who used to be a bad guy, made sth. horrible. However, he changed because of his wife. Then, he wants to do worth thing. Actually, he just support to get remunerations. Little Bill, a policeman, who should be a righteous man, but as a villain in this movie. And he treats Ned which is very terrible.

[Chika 2013]

Hi. This is Chika.
In my opinion, Little Bill's treatment of Ned did not justify Mummy's revenge. In this movie, no one is hero. all pepole bear the blame and unforgiven. Even though Mummy could change himself once thanks to his wife, his nature never change. (Even though he was away on a trip not for his honor but for money of his children, my way of looking at him won't change.) Finally, this movie caused a question " What is this country ,U.S..". I have some doubts about news of Syria now. So I won't draw a conclusion now.

[Saki1992]

Hello, Mr. David.

1. I don't know what Obama does, so I'm not sure. However, I think he is like little Bill. It is because I think America has enough money and doesn't need to get money by violence. In addition, I have an image of "Strong America," which makes other countries not willing to oppose to America. I don't know why I have this image, but maybe it's because of the history of the Pacific war. Anyway, I have to learn about the international relations more! It's very serious and delicate topic, so it's important to know it well and rightly.

Saki Kosaka

[goerlin]

Hi, David!

I think Obama is more like Little Bill, who acts violently to set an example that will discourage others from acting violently. Although I don’t know really have concerns for politics, but I think Obama is trying to prevent violent by acting violently and showing that America is tough and have the power to uphold world peace. In my opinion, the U.S military action may cause more death and suffering to the people in Syria. For me, violent would just cause more violent and revenge, not peace.

Goer

[Nasser2013]

1. Is Obama (acting for the United States) like William Munny, who acts violently 1. for money, & 2. for revenge? Is he like Little Bill, who acts violently 1. to set an example that will discourage others from acting violently, & 2. to show how tough he is? Why? How?

i think Obama acting for the U.S. by having avoided intervention in Syria for 2 years
so he is not like Little Bill

[Faris]

4. Think about your friends sitting around at home discussing the news of the world. In your conversations, how do you see the U.S.? Is it like a Batman movie or like UNFORGIVEN? In the view of your peers, does America exercise its great power of destruction in a morally clear way or a morally confused way? Or is it a mix? Give examples to illustrate what you mean?

Well, Different people hold, for sure, different opinions. It gets so nervous when my friends and I talk about politics for many reasons. Nether Obama nor any other politicians living on this world will exercise altruistic deeds. In other words, Batman' way of solving things and dealing with is far away from the reality we are living in. Regarding Syria, some of my friends take the side that says that America exercises its great power of destruction in a morally clear way while the others take the opposite side.

[Reem-Aleshaiwy]

We can't really tell if Obama is trying to help Syria by having the American military involved, or there is another intention from that. Maybe it will cause a world war. The main problem is that we don't know! We don't know if it is going to help Syrians. We don't know what is going to happen after hitting Assad. We don't even know Obama's target. The whole situation is vague. Therefore, we can't judge anyone since everything is unclear!

[RAFAELC]

Hi

In connection with the current situation in Syria, I agree with the fact that the information we receive is a bunch of lies. Nobody has the complete file to let him reach a clear idea about what is going on. One thing is "the official explanation" and a very different thing is the real motivation to do whatever the goverment decides to do.

The US goverment has nurtured a lot of institutions and services that, maybe in their begining, had a clear purpose to serve to the citizens. After the time these institutions like CIA, FBI, NSA, etc. seem to have become independents and serve to different interest than the average citizen's needs.

A clear example about these institutions serving the people "against" the people is the secret program recently denounced by Eduard Snowden.
I wonder what else we do not know. I am sure that this is like an iceberg: we only see a quarter of the whole thing.

Once we lose the idea about what is correct and what is not, things can only get worse. Once we do not know who are the good and who are the bad guys
- and this is always very uncertain to decide - wars can only mean indiscriminated destruction. Just like the end of the film UNFORGIVEN where evryone has their own reason and the only dialog is the gun shooting.